On the occasion of the first joint meeting between the EU and the European Space Agency (ESA) (EUROPE 12265/8) in more than 8 years, the director general of ESA, Jan Wörner, reviewed his objectives and his vision of what European cooperation could be in the medium and long term. He also expressed his willingness to send a European astronaut to the moon as part of an international partnership. (Interview by Pascal Hansens)
Agence Europe - Are you happy with the today outcome of the common Space Council?
Jan Wörner - We had only one day. It was only the short ESA council and the space council for us. This is our first Space Council after a long period. Of course, it was not an interactive debate at large.
ESA was always eager to have a Space Council. We always asked for that each year. And now after many, many years it happens. So, I am happy that we have this Space Council because this is part of the 2004 agreement framework. And therefore, it’s good that we have it! Now, we have to develop it content-wise.
What could be some concrete fields of action for this Space Council?
So, climate change is a topic which is clear. It was also mentioned space debris, space debris removal, solar flare, cybersecurity... We don’t have a lack of topics!
We have to prepare those topics for the next Space Council and focus on what are the topics which fit best to this Council. What was clear for all was that space is like a structure for our today society. Therefore, space is an “enabler”. This is the basis and now we will go for the next space council also with topics where we need strategic discussion and decision between the EU and ESA.
As a Member state, Germany, they are ready to have the next space council about one-year time, in the second semester of 2020.
Did you talk about ‘autonomous’ access to space during the space?
Autonomous access to space was mentioned. It was also mentioned that we should have something such as a buy European act, which is from the legal point of view rather difficult in Europe. It’s easy in the United States of America but not in Europe.
ESA is working on a competitive launcher system a launcher family. But competition is fierce, so that means we are looking for future development.
Autonomous access was mentioned even by Member states where I was surprised that they mention it, because they have no asset, nothing, in access to space they are just using it These are states such as Sweden, Ireland, Belgium, Austria, Austria, or Latvia.
For ESA, we have a document (la declaration commune signée à Madrid en 2018 – EUROPE 12128/8) which states clearly the principle of autonomous access to space. They are some others talking about ‘unhindered’.
Independent and autonomous access are very close. But ‘unhindered’ access to space is more dangerous. But it still to be developed what it means content-wise.
Do you think that European preference would be a solution?
European preference is for me a must! But not at any price.
Which means?
Which means that industry needs to be competitive.
How do you see the cooperation between the ESA, the European Commission and the future EU space agency?
What I believe is 2 things. I could take a legal position and say on the basis the Convention of ESA of 1975, which is still valid, which is an international treaty with a level of national law, and say this is all ESA task! I could mention the framework agreement of 2004 where it says clearly that we need to avoid unnecessary duplication.
But we need a more future-oriented approach. We have the EU method and we have the EU possibilities as legal and political body across all the different disciplines. We have ESA with its special instruments how to support industry in all Member states, not only in the strong Member states.
So, these different methods and different entities can work together for the best of Europe. And that’s why I am looking for a coherent approach for the sake of Europe. The Financial Framework Partnership Agreement (FFPA) might be the instrument to clarify some of the aspect even beyond institutional borders.
Do you think that a CopernicusSat could be in the pipeline, such as Eumetsat?
Eumetsat has the responsibility for some of the Copernicus satellites. We see something different, where we also have a discussion on Eumetsat: this is space weather. That could be something that Eumetsat could care of. And we need it urgently!
So, I am proposing to the ministerial meeting at the end of this year a space weather mission, to go to L5, the Lagrange point, to have some system for the future.
But the services, this is at the end of the day not the task for ESA. We believe we need some external services provider for that.
At the beginning of your mandate, the first one, you proposed the moon village, where are we now regarding that project?
Yes, it’s done! The moon village is done! So, I don’t have to mention it any longer. The idea is there. And it’s interesting that countries are taking it up where I did not even expect it.
Look to what the vice-president of the USA who says he wants going back to the moon. Now, Jim Brindenstine, the administrator of NASA, said, “forward to the moon”. This is always the wording we were using. And the “forward to the moon” means not repeating what we have done 50 years ago, but in a different setup with international partnerships, public private partnerships, human and robots.
This is exactly part of the moon village!
And the Chinese, the Canadians and the Japanese are part of it. It’s not a single project, it’s a multipartner opened concept. That was the wording that I was always using. So, it’s done, I can resign!
Would you be willing to send a European citizen to the moon within this international partnership?
JW -I always make a joke. The Americans are always talking about American boots on the moon. So OK, we can have a European foot in those shoes!
So, that means, we are ready to send Europeans to the moon. I am ready to take the responsibility to send a European astronaut to the moon.