The former Italian Prime Minister and President of the European Commission, Romano Prodi, has criticized the lack of a shared vision among progressive political parties on how to tackle growing social inequalities. He welcomes the efforts made to bring the two shores of the Mediterranean closer together, even though, in his view, the European Union has done nothing to find a political solution to the wars in the Near and Middle East. He also advises Europeans to adapt to a new era of transatlantic relations which, in his view, will never return to normal. (interview conducted on 20 May by Mathieu Bion)
Agence Europe - Bringing together the people around the Mediterranean sea is a project that is close to your heart. What should Europeans do to increase cooperation and mutual understanding?
Romano Prodi - This is my main dream : a strong European commitment for the Mediterranean area. This is a political emergency.
[When I was president of the European Commission,] I tried to convince my colleague Commissioners to back a great project that I had in my mind. The idea was to create 20 or 30 twin universities, each university with double headquarters, one North and one South, for example the universities of Athens and Cairo, with the same number of students and professors coming from the Northern country and to Southern country.
It has been impossible at the time because, Northern countries were telling that it was money wasted.
But three months ago, the European Commissioner for the Mediterranean, Dubravka Šuica, decided to relaunch the project (see EUROPE 13732/2). Now I think that we could really demonstrate that we can make a difference and that 'Mare Nostrum' can be called a sea belonging - at the same time - to the Northern and Southern countries.
Migration is a sensitive issue in Member States like Italy. Is there a need to promote legal immigration in EU of workers ?
In the short run, we must have a European policy of linking together different people. I was shocked to read in Le Monde that successful Moroccan migrants living in France go back to Morocco because they don't feel welcome in France.
The migration problem will become more and more important because of the demographic situation in Europe. We live in a contradiction in which we need immigrants but we don't create the condition for the people who want to come to Europe.
For sure we need regulation and control also in order to organize the arrivals. But a common entity is missing in order to help migrants be part of a new community.
It is now a dividing point in European politics because many parties exploit the fear of immigration for political reasons. And this makes it more and more difficult to create the condition of mutual understanding that is necessary for the future. So I am not optimistic.
In the Middle East, there is a war going on in Iran after the attacks of United States and Israel. Then tensions between Israel and Palestine exploded again. Is the EU doing enough to find a political solution ?
If for 'enough' you mean 'nothing', you're right, because Europe has done nothing !
The geographical areas you mentioned are so close, not only geographically, but also to the deep European history.
I am very unhappy about the European role. The 'Board of Peace' is a typical example of non-existing European role.
And in the Iranian conflict, Europe has been inexistent. But I am not surprised.
Why not ?
Because we could say the same thing concerning the Ukrainian war. There was a common positive action on the defense side, but not enough political strength to take the initiative for settling the conflict.
Is it because European countries are divided or because there is a lack of leadership ?
Well, how can you have a leadership with a veto right?
Veto right means that you will never have a leadership because anything can be stopped by the veto of any country. And when you have 27 members, the statistical probability of having a veto is very high. And the country who uses the veto does not pay anything.
Then, leadership becomes more and more difficult with coalition governments that spend the most part of the time trying to solve their internal difficulties, not to have an innovative policy to lead Europe.
Third, Europe traditionally made all the great progress after a strong agreement between France and Germany, of course with the backing of Italy and Spain. France and Germany are friends but, in this moment, they are not brothers. You need brotherhood for making Europe advancing.
How do you analyze the relationships between the EU and the United States of America under Donald Trump ?
I was upset about the change of American policy. In my life, I have seen increasing distance between The United States and Europe. But, in spite of that, we had a common direction and common values.
Now the problem is values. Trump is despising Europe and our democratic system, he's considering Europe as a hostile entity.
I think it is impossible to come back to the old friendly relations. American feeling is hostile, and European feeling is now... uneasy with the United States. The problem is that good relations are necessary, not relations built on submission.
So, Europe needs a genuine foreign and defense policy. This is absolutely indispensable, but we go back to the point in which France and Germany are friends but not brothers.
How do you convince citizens that Europe can help solving the problems they face in their daily life ?
Regulations, regulations don't take the heart of people. When Europe is at stake and you say to people: "To create Europe, you have to do this or that," people will say yes.
How do you explain the fact that progressive ideas like social progress, justice, equal rights struggle to convince people to vote for progressive parties?
Do we have a common strong platform that can be called reformist or that can fight the horrible split of income that we have created step by step?
In the first generation after the war, there was a slow but consistent improvement of social justice. Now we have an increasing social injustice and there is no common European idea of the socialist parties on how to change this trend.
How do explain new majorities at EU level between the Christian Democrats and Conservatives and the far right ?
The EPP is now without any clear direction. I don't think it is in its interest to follow the line of the American Republicans.
In this moment, to put Europe on the right track, the only way is for Socialists and Christian Democrats to find some common ground.